Hello everyone and welcome back to the Rebel Author Podcast episode 17. Today’s podcast is a good’un. It’s a no bullshit, hard talking home truths episode. You might not like everything you hear, but it is the truth and hopefully it will give you a swift kick up the butt to refocus and drive harder towards your writing goals. Today’s guest is Becca Syme who wrote Dear Writer, You Need to Quit. But what should writers quit? Becca is here to tell you.
THIS WEEK’S QUESTION IS:
What do you need to quit?
This week’s book recommendations are:
Dear Writer Are You In Burn Out?
Dear Writer, You Need to Quit
THIS EPISODE IS SPONSORED BY
Find out more about the Kobo Writing Life platform for authors here. Read the Kobo Writing Life blog here. Listen to the Kobo Writing Life podcast for authors here.
Listener Rebel of the Week is Tom Fowler
If you’d like to be a Rebel of the week please do send in your story, it can be any kind of rebellion. You can email your rebel story to rebelauthorpodcast@gmail.com or tweet me @rebelauthorpod
If you’d like to support the show, and get access to all the bonus essays, posts and content, you can support the show by visiting: www.patreon.com/sachablack
More about Becca Syme
What Should Writers Quit?
Sacha Black
Hello and welcome back to The Rebel Author podcast. Today I am with Becca Syme. Becca is a Gallup certified strengths coach with a master’s degree in transformational leadership and 13 years of experience coaching organizations, individuals and writers in success systems, strategic alignment and self leadership. She teaches the Write Better, Faster courts and coaches the strengths for writers program. Baca lives in Montana with her wine drinking cat. I need to ask about that. And a three 360 degree review a view of the Rocky Mountains that belongs in a Brad Pitt movie. I wish I could see that view. Welcome. Tell me about the cat cuz.
Becca Syme
So yeah, he’s hilarious. I am a person who I don’t drink out of stemmed glasses I drink out of like the ones you set on the you know, and he will come and put his face and every single glass and so I had wine out one day and he just started drinking it. I’m like, dude, that’s alcohol. And he’s just like, oh tastes so good, you know. And so now it’s a joke with all of my friends that like my cat drinks wine, cuz he’ll just stick his face and everything on the counter. So
Sacha Black
How was he afterwards? I mean did he stumble? What’s he drunk?
Becca Syme
Like? It’s weird, because I’m not sure if he didn’t metabolize it, or if he just didn’t drink enough. Because you know how cats they lick. And it’s like, you know, you don’t even know if they’re really getting water. Yeah. But he didn’t drink a ton of it. And like, I’ve tried. This is so awful. I’ve tried other alcohols. Like I’ve tried to leave scotch out and like rum and stuff just to see Yeah, and he only drinks wine. Like he doesn’t like anything hard.
Sacha Black
So is he a red wine drinker? white wine? Does he have a preference?
Becca Syme
Yeah, why not drink wine? I’ve tried. I mean not like, you know, I left it out. Yeah.
Sacha Black
Oh my god, I love it. I love it. Absolutely brilliant. I used to have a cat that was more dog than cat. So I mean I am a huge, huge cat person. So yeah, my grandmother had 300 cats and one rooster that ruled all of the cats. It was mental. We are all like genetically cat people. My son is already obsessed. But yeah, anyway, right. I’m so sorry, complete tangent. Tell everyone a little bit more about you and your writing journey and how you got to where you are today.
Becca Syme
Yeah, I started off like in my bio, I started off coaching, you know, organizational alignment. And the degree that I have is part like organizational leadership and part I guess I call it psychology. Right. It’s like how how are you successful? How do we make someone into a person who can have success? And so I was doing that long before I started writing. And then I actually started writing fiction because I got fired. I mean, I was writing fiction before this, but I was like, well, might as well try because I have a severance package. And so like, I started writing fiction and laid off fired whatever. Anyway, and, and I, I started making money at it because it was at a time when, you know, the indie market was really, really good. And so I started coaching authors, sort of because people would come to me, like not intentionally I didn’t I, I definitely did not get into this to become an author coach. It was more, I had a skill set. And authors have a business that they run and not a lot of authors think of themselves as business owners. And so some of the stuff. Yeah, some of the stuff I was that I would do with organizations, it’d be like, well, let’s align you for, you know, who’s on the bus and how do we get everybody in the right places and stuff. And I found that authors did not naturally think of that stuff like HR stuff. And so I was like, Well, I can help with that. And I started coaching, because people asked me to, and then it just kind of like literally ballooned from there, which is great, but I would intending to do
Sacha Black
The most wonderful things always come out of those, serendipitous. Yeah, at my background was also in psychology, which is why I think there were certain chapters of yours that really appealed. Other ones made me like, oh, we’ll get into that later. But yeah, that was definitely it is some of the testing and stuff I was very interested in. I’m a huge fan of Myers Briggs. So and I But one of the things that he said I just want to talk about was authors not seeing themselves as business people, which I think is, I mean, especially for those writers who want to make a business. No, no, sorry. No, no. Those writers who want to make a living Yeah, exactly. Those people who want to quit their jobs. I mean, Honey, what are you doing that’s not a business, you know? Yeah. The minute you make a sale, you have a business.
Becca Syme
Otherwise, you’re a lottery winner. If you’re not a business person, you’re a lottery winner.
Sacha Black
Yeah. And we all know what the odds of that are. Okay, so the reason I asked you on the podcast was because I recently read one of your books, Dear Writer, You Need to Quit. It is a very controversial title, which I love, obviously with my rebel nature. But before we scare any listeners off, could you tell everyone a little bit about the concept behind it and what that title really means.
Becca Syme
Yeah, so I definitely don’t want people to quit writing, right? Like I don’t want Well, that’s not true. If you want to quit and you need permission to quit, then go ahead and quit. It’s fine, you know. But for most of us, it’s we don’t want to have to quit writing, and we want to figure out how to keep doing it. And so what do you need to quit doing? If you are not going to quit writing? So basically, like, you can’t do everything, I’m sorry, but it’s not possible. And so what do you need to quit if you’re not going to quit writing is kind of I guess that’s really the big core concept behind the book.
Sacha Black
Absolutely. And it is one of the best tough talking books I’ve read in a while because I mean, you do not beat around the bush, you tell everyone you tell them how it is, you know, if anybody’s listening and they need a swift kick up the backside, this is the book for you. And I will be linking to it in the show notes. So one of the things I loved about your book was the concept of always questioning our internal assumptions, we make a whole shitload of assumptions, you know, and we just assume that these assumptions are correct. And we all know what people say about assumptions. So can you talk to me a little bit about questioning the premise and our assumptions? And, and the delightful little phrase that I read in a book sarcastic voice, but do you? Can’t you? I literally, that is how I read it every single time.
Becca Syme
That’s how I say it like, yes. So it’s often when somebody comes to me for coaching, and they’ll be like, okay, Becca, I need to write 12 books a year, and I’ll be like, but do you? Like, really? Are you sure? And not that I think it’s bad to write 12 books a year writing fast as bad or anything like that. But usually, the people who struggle with it, they struggle for a reason, and it is not because they’re stupid, or lazy, it’s because there’s something else going on in their head that makes it hard for them to write fast or to write, let’s say, to turn around product quickly if we’re talking in business terms. And, and everybody’s brain is very, very different. And we don’t think about what that means when we assume or accept assumptions about what we should be doing. And so it’s like, you know, somebody says, I did this, and we think, Okay, great. That’s what successful people do. And so I should do that. And literally, I always say, to everyone, and every question, I’m like, but but do you like, do you have to do that to be successful? Not because I think you don’t, but because if the only thing driving you to do that is because somebody said you should, then yeah, you should not listen to that.
Sacha Black
Yeah, absolutely. And I think also, and you know, because I’ve, I’ve done that I need to write faster I need to write more words and actually all that has happens is you end up hating writing. Yeah. And that’s not healthy either. Yeah, writings.
Becca Syme
Like that’s the crazy part that we don’t think about is we think, like, we don’t think about what the assumption is doing to us. We don’t always consider the cost. It’s like, Okay, I gotta write fast. How do I do that? Let’s go and take every single productivity class in the entire world. And literally, I have people come into my class who are like, oh, I’ve taken that I’d taken that I’ve taken that I’ve taken that. And I’m like, and you never thought to question the premise of whether you should be trying to write fast or not. Like you’ve literally tried everything, and you can’t just give up that premise. Right? So that’s one of the tough talks
Sacha Black
Because people don’t want to hear that they want to write faster, you know, but that if that doesn’t work for you and your brain, then maybe you just shouldn’t write faster.
Becca Syme
Yeah. And maybe there are other things that you’re better at that you should be focusing your time on instead of beating yourself up for just not being able to write 45,000 words a day. Like, everybody can do that, you know?
Sacha Black
We can all dream now. Yeah. Um, yeah. So what are some of the most common things that writers need to quit the premise or quit quit quit doing or quit? Yeah, I mean, what are words this evening? You know what I’m trying to say?
Becca Syme
So some of the biggest ones, I mean, the first big one is because a successful person did it. That means anybody can do it. And and the part of the issue is that most successful people don’t take their success as seriously. And they say things like, if I can write 10,000 words a day anybody can, because it’s so easy for them to do and so they think, well, it must be equally as easy for everyone else. And then they set that expectation for the other writers to say If you’re not hitting this mark, then you’re not going to be successful. And that’s the assumption we make. Again, it’s not the assumption that the successful people put on us. It’s an assumption we make based on how we assimilate what success means. So the biggest, biggest, biggest premise that people don’t question is that people are successful because of the program or the process that they used, instead of based on their personality alignment with the process. So somebody who does dictation for instance, has a particular type of personality that makes dictation really successful for them. And there are people for whom if you try to teach them how to dictate, they will literally stop writing for months, months. So question the premise instead, right? Like it’s possible that the person’s success is not replicable for you. And that’s hard. It’s hard to hear. But would you rather hear the truth or Would you rather that I liked you and make you spend money on my productivity stuff? Right, like, I guess that’s the bottom line, you know,
Sacha Black
And the thing is, is that we’re not, that is not the only model of success. There are as many, you know, as many successful authors as there are paths to success. And I guess the thing here is about finding that thing that is uniquely you, and then doing it a lot. Yes.
Becca Syme
As much as possible.
Sacha Black
Yeah, yeah. Okay. What’s the most common unrealistic expectation that you come across when coaching writers?
Becca Syme
I would say, this is going to be painful because I think that you probably know what’s coming. You probably know what I’m going to say. Um, I think the most unrealistic expectation is that everyone is capable of equal amounts of success. Like it is unfortunate that that’s just not the truth. But it really is, it really is true that not everyone is equally capable of the same type of success or even just like somehow it’s easier for us to conceive of this. Not everybody has the same amount of free time. And granted, it’s because you made choices like you chose to have, you know, commitments or responsibilities or whatever. I mean, not all of us choose to have a job we can’t hand you know, can’t choose not to. But we have a life that is set up in a certain way that dictates how much time we have. And that is a very, very hard truth to swallow. That if you don’t have the free time to get done what you need to do, then you’re not going to get it all done. And is it better to try to do the unrealistic thing or is it better to try to model yourself to be as successful as you can, given what you can expect from yourself and then grow from there, right like everyone is capable of growth and everyone is capable of more success than they have. But not everyone is capable of the same type of or level of success. And that is super painful. Like I, I hate saying it out loud because I know people are just going to get mad about it. But I’m like, well, but let’s look at, you know, statistics, history, everything is against you.
Sacha Black
So I have a phrase that I like to use on this podcast, and I’m desperately trying to get some mugs with it on. But the phrase is, I think you’re going to enjoy it, suck it up princess. At the end of the day, you know, it is true. But nobody, and this is you know, I’m going to come back and say this again. But nobody is saying that you can’t be successful. Because at the end of the day, what is your definition of success? Because people don’t have the same level aren’t capable of the same levels of success, but not everybody wants the same type of success either. And that is far more important if you can define what success looks Like to you, and excuse me, you know what you’re aiming for? Sorry. Um, so why do you think… I don’t know if this is just creative people, or whether this is universal but why do you think we’re all so resistant to hearing and these things and questioning the premises that actually are detrimental to us?
Becca Syme
Yeah, I’ve thought a lot about this because my this book that I just finished writing, which is a follow up to dear writer, you need to quit. I talk about the dream that a lot of us grow up with, is we have this picture in our head that drives us. That is like this dream that we have. Right? And we’re so encouraged and especially in in the United States, it’s like the dream, the bootstraps the American dream, you know what I mean? And so there’s this sense of if anyone says anything against my dream that they’re somehow they don’t want success for me or they don’t want me to be happy or whatever. And and my point is, if you are going to be disappointed because you didn’t accomplish that dream, if you’re going to look back on your life and think your life was worthless, because you didn’t accomplish this thing, wouldn’t you rather be able to look back on a life that you’re happy with and proud of that was more realistic. And, and, and, and again, this is a personality thing. Not everybody’s wired this way. So some people are really going to balk against that. And that’s okay. I’m glad those people exist because they’ll continue to encourage everybody to follow their dreams and look out for their dreams. And I think we need that also. But we also need people who are going to say, okay, but if you don’t hit it, it’s not because you are stupid. It’s not because you’re broken. It’s not because there’s something wrong with you or you’re a failure. It’s because it’s normal. It’s just not Normal to overshoot. But I really think a lot of it has to do with the fact that we assimilate happiness with like we we have a picture of happiness and we don’t understand how to reframe that for ourselves.
Sacha Black
yeah and I think there are lots of things when you do go full time that aren’t always amazing yeah so I I left my job in April May time I haven’t quite got to the end of my first year yet and it’s been a rollercoaster there are some amazing days where I am literally hysterical with elation and joy and then there are other days where I’m like WTF did I do? This is terrible. Yeah, so every dream it you know if I could merge the grass is not greener with every g You know, every dream some you know, they’re not all parts of your dream are amazing. I think at the end of the day, everybody has shit things in the day job.
Becca Syme
Yes.
Not all dreams are dreamy, right? Like, yes. Not a fantasy. It’s reality. Yeah. And and I think we deal with it so much better. And again, this is about unrealistic expectations for me. Because when you hold them, like if I hold an unrealistic expectation in my head, that my job should always be fun. Well, the reality is, it’s not going to be fun all the time. So if you expect it to be fun, it’s going to not be fun, and you’re going to be pissed about it not being fun. So wouldn’t it be easier to just expect it to not be fun sometimes, and then at least it will only not be fun, and it will also be pissy? Right, like, exactly so logical to me, but I guess I don’t know.
Sacha Black
Absolutely. This comes into another one of the chapters where you say, you know, look at the past and look at the history. And, you know, how hard was it to get to the point where you could leave your job, you know, you had to work hard to get that, you know, what were you expecting it suddenly to be easy. I don’t know if I was maybe I was I think a little bit of it. was, you know, but yeah, we then learned that reality rather fast. And but yeah, exactly. Okay, so this is a awesome segue into my next question, which is sort of a two part question. So I want to talk about reality. And I found chapter 14, which talks about reality the hardest to read. However, I did read it this morning was like what was I moaning about it? anyway. At the time,
Becca Syme
I think the first time you hear it it’s not fun.
Sacha Black
It was not fun. And I felt so called out. I was hormonal. It was I was, you know, it was hard.
Becca Syme
I am legitimately Sorry about that, by the way. I hate doing that to people. But I also am here like, so. Yeah, yeah. It’s not fun.
Sacha Black
Yeah, no, but so let’s tell I will explain briefly, obviously, without going into all of it. But in the chapter you talk about reality, and the market and how, you know, we need to get real with our expectations and our view of the market and the fact that most books don’t sell, and I think you’re so I wanted to bring up one specific statistic, which I think he said was each to $2.99 book has a 1.4% chance of earning more than $2,300 a year, which means that most writers will not earn enough money to quit their jobs to write, or certainly not with one book anyway, which is why you advocate not quitting your day job as soon as it’s possible for you to quit your day job. And also, I think the whole just work harder concept is better bullshit there. And so tell everyone a little bit about the reality of writing and publishing and what they’re up against if they really truly want to make a career out of this.
Becca Syme
Yeah, it really is for me about resilience. It’s not, don’t try it’s don’t expect like if you are expect that your book is going to make less than $1,000. Because 90% of books make less than $1,000 a year, you know, in their lifetime. So if you expect that to happen, then you will be pleasantly surprised when it makes 2300. Or if it makes 10,000. Like you’ll be pleasantly surprised and the more times you do that, then you’ll be able to quit your day job. And the more I guess predictable it becomes when you get more books over that hundred thousand ranking mark, right? Because the when you’re only selling a book or two a day, which is the top hundred thousand out of seven plus million, like 7 million and counting books, we’re still only seeing about 100,000 that are selling one or more books a day. That’s not a great metric, right so most of the books and I can’t remember who it was that said this. And so I hesitate to even bring it up but it just was so staggering, like there still are millions of books on Kindle that haven’t even been purchased one time, like millions of books that haven’t even been bought one time. And I’m assuming this will be none of your people who are listening to this podcast.
And I’m assuming that it won’t, because most people who take this seriously would start marketing, right and so they wouldn’t be in that place. But even still, you’re looking at an uphill battle. It is not as easy as the people who are marketing. Well make it seem and that’s basically just a good rule of thumb for everything. Anytime something looks too good to be true. It is. Anytime something looks easier than it should be. It is not that easy. It’s that the people who are doing it have found a way to do it. That may have multiple different sources. It may be because they’ve released a whole bunch of books it may be because they have natural talent, it may be luck. It may be timing. There’s there’s many different set factors to success. But the point is I don’t want people to be disappointed with how their books do and think that there’s something wrong with them. Because their books aren’t selling. No, most books don’t sell. It’s okay. Like it’s okay.
Sacha Black
Yeah, absolutely. And I think that’s what’s so nice about your book is that it is about empowering writers to be okay with whatever they have and whatever they whatever they’re, I can’t think the word but whatever the thing that they get. Wait, but nevermind, I you know what I mean, there. Yeah. A lot. Yeah, exactly. Yep. And so, Part B, we’ve talked about the shit bit and so I wanted I wanted to talk
Becca Syme
That’s a great way to put it by the way.
Sacha Black
Well I mean it is. Let’s be real. Yeah. Let’s talk about the good bit and what they can do. If an author is determined to make a go of this, what can they do to set themselves up for success in the long term?
Becca Syme
You really need to know what you’re good at, like you really, really need to know, for your personality and also for you as a writer, like craft wise and, like, you need to look a lot at your alignment, which if you think about your spine, and how when your spine gets out of alignment, it’s like you it’s painful. You walk differently, like and then all of a sudden, you get your spine, you crack your back and it’s like, oh, I can live again. This is what living is like, right? That same thing happens when you understand who you are as a person, what can you expect of yourself, what’s realistic to expect from somebody who who is wired the way that you are? You know, if you are a person who needs to think more than other people, then that’s going to be part of your writing process. You can can’t expect that you can stop thinking and write faster, like you have to think better in order to get faster, and not to stop thinking. So if you’re a person who does that, then you use it as a strength instead of trying to get rid of it. There’s so much of our thinking about success that is really skewed. Like we have an assumption that there is a model for how everyone is successful out there. And all we need to do is conform to the model. But if you assume there is a model, it’s not that there’s one, it’s that there’s 1000. And there are 1000 different ways to be successful. And if you can find the one that’s right for you find a person who’s more like you. And then and the key for how do you do this, if you’re determined is you keep getting better. Like you keep looking for the places where you can stand out and shine and meet reader expectations and write great books and you may have to release some of the unrealistic expectations and you can’t see how uncomfortable I just got with because you can’t see the video but I just got uncomfortable because releasing unrealistic expectations sometimes means like I’m I may not be a fast release right to market writer or I may not be a Pulitzer Prize winner, like there are there’s a range of different levels of success and you want to find the one that you can most realistically shoot for. And then shoot for them over and over and over again until you hit it.
Sacha Black
So sorry. And I love this. I love this so much because it’s about personal empowerment. And each writer finding the thing that they and this is this is what and the more I listen to you and obviously really thinking about the book. It’s actually easy to spot the things that you work well with because nine times out of 10 they’re the things that you like and enjoy doing. So it makes it actually easy to do those things. Yes.
Becca Syme
Hundred percent. Yep. But people are so surprised when they come into my class. And they’re like, Well, you know, I have this problem where I think all the time between my books, I’m like, that’s not a problem. It’s a strength. And like, and will be like, Well, what I really want to do is I want to go for a walk before I write, but I know I’m supposed to sit down and write I’m like, no, go for a walk. Like your natural inclination is to do things that help your strength, like your personality, strong parts. They are naturally trying to get you to do what you should do, to be more aligned with them. And so a lot, so much of it is letting people do what they do. Like instead of outlining you pants, because you like the exhilaration of not knowing what happens next, and then you’re like, Oh, well, but to get faster I need to outline and I’m like, No, you don’t. You need to getting better at pantsing? Yeah, you know?
Sacha Black
Yeah. And it’s so funny because I, I’m now looking at my computer screen for those listeners who obviously cannot see us. And I have my computer two remind us that say you have permission. Because I think so many of us get caught up in, you know exactly what you’re saying, we think we have to do something because either somebody else has done it, or you’ve made this, we’ve internalized an assumption. And actually, you have permission to experiment. And I think the other thing that we often forget is that we change as humans all the time. Yes, our innate, you know, core traits and personalities don’t particularly change, but our methods and systems can change. You know, when before I had a kid I was able to write until two o’clock in the morning because I wasn’t going to be woken up at 6am you know, now, I can’t do that anymore. You know, you not only do does everybody listening have permission to experiment And to enjoy the things that they enjoy. You know, you can enjoy those things, guys, it’s okay to enjoy the things you enjoy. You have permission to change your mind and to experiment and to try a different system as well. And I had something else I wanted to ask you, but it’s vanished after my brain. So many things do now post child.
Unknown Speaker
Brain. Yeah, yeah,
Sacha Black
they lied. They said that went you know, once they regardless,
Becca Syme
it doesn’t.
Sacha Black
Um, okay. What are the most important or biggest, you know, mindset things an author can do in order to be successful?
Becca Syme
I would say, get really familiar with the question the premise method like the QTP what I call QTP, right, which is, anytime somebody tells you that you should be doing something or that Successful authors do this or whatever. You always always I don’t care who says it. I don’t care if it’s Stephen King, I don’t care if it’s me. I don’t care who it is you always question the premise. Because for every 80% of people that it works for, there’s 20% of people that it doesn’t. And so here’s a big one, because we’re going into the new year into 2020. Everybody’s buying planners, because planners make you productive. But do they? They don’t. They don’t make people productive. They help people who are already productive with planners be more productive. And the rest of us they pissed the hell off all the time. And we buy planners trying to find the right one that’s going to magically make us productive. And what I say is okay, look back in your history, has a planner ever made you productive before? No, well, there’s not a good chance that there’s going to be a magic one out there that’s going to make you productive, there’s a better chance that you You have a different way of being productive than by using a planner. And let’s figure out what that is right? So like for me the mindset shift of don’t ever buy the banana oil is such a huge deal you always question the premise of everything.
Sacha Black
So I feel called out again. Oh yeah, I so i’m uh, I’m uh well I’m E/I border, but predominantly, EN TJ so planning… or no structure works well for me it.
Becca Syme
was gonna say yep, structure
Sacha Black
works well for me. Not necessarily planning however, I have tried possibly four times to plan 2020 and my brains just like nope, fuck you. You can have goals but you can’t have a plan. I tried to map time to tasks to and I just, I am so was it and I’m yes so resistant. And I’m like, why can’t I do this? Why can I not just, you know, set a date. It’s also deadlines. I try and set a deadline, and I will immediately rebel against that deadline. Like I just, it is it is, as soon as I try and impose a rule on myself, I’m like, Well, I’m gonna do everything I possibly can get it now. But yeah, okay, maybe I don’t need to plan.
Becca Syme
You don’t I mean, so you, you would be much better finding the thing that makes you excited to work every day. And focusing on that, right. It’s like what makes me excited to get up and do this next day of work. Because the the structure part can be as easily decided in the moment as it can be imposed from four months from now. It does, it definitely doesn’t need to be, especially if you find that you’re better off of you don’t know what’s coming and then all of a sudden, you’re like, All right, I’m going to work for the next four hours and then It’s like, like, I don’t have time to get mad about that, because I need to do it. Right. So like, there’s all this stuff about knowing yourself and how you respond to pressure and how you respond to time and stuff like that. That’s just so important for us to know.
Sacha Black
Any, I guess tips and tricks other than writers being cognizant of what they enjoy any tips or tricks for writers to try and work out what things suit them better than others?
Becca Syme
Yeah, I love to use personality metrics. Like I just like to have a place where I can say, and I’ll caveat this in a second, but where I can say there’s a continuum between this on one side and this on the other side, and I fall here. And what that means is, if we’re looking at like objective versus subjective thinking, for instance, that has an impact, where you fall on that continuum has an impact on how you respond. Respond to being surprised by things. And so if you are an objective versus subjective thinker, it’s important to know that. But the caveat I’ll make is that any individual test is only as accurate as it is valid. And I mean, it’s only as predictable or predictive as it is scientifically valid. So there are some that are more predictive than others. But I like I basically like using all of them. I mean, we use everything that I can get my hands on, especially if there’s a question we can’t figure out about somebody. It’s like, well, there has to be a way to measure that brain function. So let’s talk about that. So everything from motivation to time, sensitivity to introversion and extraversion, to creativity to strong success metrics, right, like, I want to use everything I can get my hands on to figure out what I can reasonably expect from myself and I’m a huge fan of objective testing because I think that it’s so much easier when someone else has made a prediction based on what they’ve seen in patterns, especially if it’s backed up by research, which again, I prefer the ones that are backed up by research, but I think everything is useful as a starting point as a starting point.
Sacha Black
Amazing. Yeah, I think we all we all find it difficult to be objective about our selves. Yes. Yeah. And that is really at the heart at the end of the day that is the heart of Dear Writer, You Need to Quit because it is the assumption that we are unable to be objective, it is our subjective opinions that we are unable to be objective about. Okay. I also felt called out by the burnout chapter. I’m really, really, really good at burning myself out. I am like a pro expert at burning myself out. So I collapsed two months ago, because I literally burned myself out. Yeah, wasn’t cool was a bit of a wake up. And However, I’m a workaholic. I love what I do. And not only am I not great at self care, it’s also actually really hard to stop doing the thing that you love. However, burnout is wildly inefficient.
Becca Syme
Yes,
Sacha Black
Which is I cannot abide in efficiency. So that is why I absolutely wanted to ask you about burnout. Just talk to me about burnout…
Becca Syme
Yeah, I think for me, there are definitely certain personalities that are going to tend towards burning harder and hotter. And if you can make sure that you’re creating as much energy as you use… most of the time, right because our… The reason we burnout is because we reached the end of our ability to create enough energy for ourselves to do all the things we’ve committed to doing right.
Sacha Black
So my brain just exploded.
Becca Syme
Yeah. Oh my god. Yeah. So if we can make sure to do the things that give us energy and make energy for us, then it’s much much easier either to deal with. So I talked about burnout, metaphorically as though it has a slope, right? So when you slide down into burnout, it can either be really really like a 90 degree angle, or it can be like 140 degree angle, right? So some of us are just going to head that way anyway. So the more we can do self care on a regular basis, and this is things like sleeping, get drinking enough water, like a ton of us are overtired because we’re dehydrated. And that’s because we over drink coffee and under drink water. So if you are resistant to stopping drinking coffee, which I understand because it is, it is. Well, I won’t go there. But yeah, so
Sacha Black
Life juice? Yes, yes it is.
Becca Syme
Right? But even if you are going to still continue to drink the same amount of coffee, drink twice as much water as you drink coffee, just to make sure that you stay hydrated. So much of our tiredness on a day to day basis is from not drinking enough water. And so, so things like very, very minimal self care. If you are a person who feels the need to read a lot, you probably make energy from reading. And it helps you to write better books don’t cut out your reading. Like so many of us look at our daily hours and we think that all of our minutes are equally up for grabs to do things like writing or working and they’re not like we need the time to make the energy So that we won’t overspend, and then burnout because that’s what makes us burnout is when we reach the end of our energy stores, and we can’t produce anymore because we’re not making enough. I talked about it in terms of pennies, right? Like you spend 1000 pennies of energy a day. And if you don’t, and then you make a certain amount from sleeping and from drinking water and taking care of yourself and watching Netflix and things like that. And if you don’t make enough then you have a store that you use up. And once you get to the end of the store, you can only make as much as you can make from the normal stuff and you don’t have any more and that’s what causes the burnout to happen. Yeah,
Sacha Black
I feel like I’ve had about 8000 epiphanies right now because I don’t even know where to begin with this festival. I feel like you have given me permission to be my high energy self because I am an exceptionally high energy person. I burst everything So some of my friends call me a conniption I, you know, I’ve either a fit of rage or a fit of excitement. There’s not really anything in between. But it is so true. But also I have, you know, friends and family and loved ones who who say to me, you’ve got to slow down, you’ve got to slow down, because they love me. But actually, I’m like, Well, no, I don’t want to slow down because I enjoy being at that pace. And just as like, you know, I need to question the premise over what types of self care I need to do in order to give me energy. Also, I need to question the premise that people are saying, you need to slow down Well, no, fuck that. I don’t want to slow down, I don’t enjoy slow.
Becca Syme
And this is the other piece that I think knowing yourself is super important. So like there’s a success metric called the Strengths Finder, which I use very, very extensively. And there’s actually a strength called High Achiever where when you have it, you do not get distressed by stopping working. So like if you stop working, you get more stressed out. Would you costs more pennies than it produces. So like we spend a whole day laying around doing nothing, all you do is expend Penny stressing out all day about the stuff that isn’t getting done. And people who don’t have that strength, look at that behavior and think I don’t, why can’t you just slow down and not work but the thing is they get energy from working. So they still need to self care, they still need to sleep, they still need to rest their body, they still need to take good care of themselves. But they don’t need to stop working in order to make energy pennies and and it’s just a crazy like, again, we internalize other people’s systems. And I think that’s the thing is when when I’m not an achiever, and I look at my high achiever, friends or partners and say, if I was doing what you’re doing, I would be exhausted. And I say, well, that’s great. You’re not me, because I’m not exhausted by all of this work. I’m exhilarated by it. And so if I’m not stressed out, then you need to let me be the boss of my time and allow me And granted, if you are genuinely stressed out and you do need self care, you have to slow down. But not not to stop, right just to do more self care and then get back into the ring again.
Sacha Black
This is so fascinating. I’ve had lots of people in my life call me an overachiever. So I’m like, I’m lolling back here. Yeah, I mean, so many epiphanies and I think it is so interesting. So my wife has chronic fatigue syndrome. So she is married to somebody who is like ridiculously high energy and she’s obviously quite low energy. And so she will look at what I’m doing and she’s like, I’m sat here watching you and I’m exhausted watching you do your stuff, you know, but we make great balance. But yeah, like it’s it is it is fascinating. the psychology behind you know, actually embracing what other people might see. weaknesses as your strengths and then using those to do more of what you love best I yeah, I really hope everybody listening is having as many epiphanies as me right now. Just on
Becca Syme
a side note too if you could talk to your wife about your high achiever, and and literally like have her take the test, have her listen to it, see what her strengths are, see what your strengths are, and then you guys talk about them, I would be willing to bet that she worries about your stress level because she thinks this is what I would feel like because I don’t have that particular thing, right. Whereas if you can say, Well, this is how I feel when I do all of this stuff. It’s the same as how you feel when you get, you know, adequate sleep and you get like when you feel at your best. That’s how I feel when I’m frenetically accomplishing things. And the way you can communicate because you then know how each other is wired. It’s like you can start to appreciate that about each other and that it makes your relationship stronger. And I mean literally, it’s like, the benefits are unbelievable.
Sacha Black
I’m grinning because she constantly says I worry about the amount of stress that you put yourself under. So yeah, and but I think it’s because I talk about stress in perhaps a way that is not her perception and her experience of stress. So I need to change the way reframe what I’m saying, because there’s stress that I’m like, Oh, I’m so busy. I’m stressed, you know, and then there’s, yeah, and then there’s actual stress.
Becca Syme
And then there’s like, your heart is legitimately your pursuit, or you’re producing cortisol. Like there’s that level of stress. That’s like, that’s negative stress. Yeah. But when you have when you get energized by being busy and busy, this actually does not stress you out. It doesn’t produce the negative effects. That there’s a really big difference between those two things. You can be extremely busy and not stressed out. Yeah, but not everybody can do that. Right. So like, it’s super important to say, Hey, if you’re not that person, I get that you’re concerned about me, I promise you, if I feel that stress level, I will do something about it. And also, I’m committing to do better self care, so that I don’t get to the burnout place. Because if you think of your plate size as being like you have a very big plate, and it can be very, very full. And then there’s this tiny margin on the outside. And it doesn’t take much to topple the margin. Yeah, and top of the plate, but you can still operate at a very, very big plate size without toppling for a long time. If you’re making the right number of pennies, and if you’re taking care of yourself. Yeah.
Sacha Black
I need to re listen to this discussion about eight times because this is so many gems here.
Becca Syme
It’s in the burnout book like burnout called Dear Writer Are You in Burnout? and all of this stuff about plate size and pennies and stuff is all in there.
Sacha Black
I’m going to add that to the show notes as well. And definitely go and purchase it. Okay, this is The Rebel Author Podcast. So tell me about a time you unleash your inner rebel.
Becca Syme
So this one was fun to think about because I have a strength called individualization. And so I am rebellious about everything. I mean, as you can probably imagine about the cutiepie that came out of my brain right? It’s like, I just hate other people’s expectations so much. But actually, I do a really specific thing and my my one of my best friends is gonna laugh when he hears this because I hate watching movies that everybody likes. Like when the movie comes out that everyone is obsessed with and they’re like, Oh my God, have you seen you know whatever it is that the time right like Virgin River or Bird Box or like the thing everybody talks about Aquaman or I’m like, fuck all of that. I never ever want to see it. It’s the dumbest thing I’ve ever heard of. Right? Like, I get so angry about how much everybody else likes it and then I’m like, screw it. So this happened recently with all the Marvel movies. I had never seen a Marvel movie. Oh my goodness are like after all of the big hype. And now this winter, I’m like, I’m gonna watch every single Marvel movie ever. They are the best like I watched and loved it and Thor Ragnarok. And now I need to see every single one of them. And my friend was like, you could have just watched him when they came out and I’m like,
Sacha Black
But would I? Amazing. I love that so much. That literally speaks to my soul. And Okay, tell listeners where they can find out more about you your books, your courses, which I have now extremely interested in. Yes, where can people find you?
Becca Syme
Go find me on the easiest places to come to YouTube and to follow the QuitCast. Because that’s all the free stuff like most of what we’ve talked about today is available just on those podcasts and you can just listen to all of them. And we talk a lot about success metrics and and then we question a lot of the premises also of these major myths that happen in author success world. And that’s the easiest place betterfasteracademy.com all one word is where all the classes and books and stuff like all the links and everything are located there, but but I would go to the YouTube channel and watch the QuitCast because especially when it comes to the author personality stuff, when it comes to strengths metrics, like I bring on authors who have those strengths, and they talk about them from their own experience. So you can see like, here’s like the very first one is about the thinking one intellection I say like, here’s three successful people who all have intellection. And let’s listen to them talk about how they are successful using that trait. And then you get to see other people who are wired like you who talk about their success in a way that feels accessible for you, as opposed to, you know, what, who knows if I can do that or not so amazing. Thank you so much. And thank you for your time today. I really, really appreciate it.
Sacha Black
And so thank you very much to all of my patrons. Thank you to the listeners. I’m Sacha Black, you’re listening to Becca Syme and this was The Rebel Author Podcast.
If you enjoyed this post, you might like these from The Rebel Author archive:
Is there something wrong with your blog atm? I just received 40 emails from you within 3 minutes?
Yes, my apologies. I accidentally deleted 80 posts and restored them, thinking that was fine. Alas it’s started sending them all out as if they were new. I’ve managed to stop the emails going out now so you shouldn’t receive any more. Please accept my apologies once again.
Absolutey loved this epsiode!
I embrace a lot of this thinking, but to hear it being said is brilliant.
That’s how I manage to do as much as I do, regularly!
But I need to have a rethink about a lot of stuff so I can make the time available to actually focus on writing more.
I really should quit the time I spend faffing around on Social Media, and actually write, otherwise, what am I trying to promote?!?!?
Amen to that, you need books to promote or else everything else is in vain.
*Tries to wire brain into writing mode….*
🙂